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Date: 06 Jan 2008 07:33:18
From: Darby
Subject: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave her
an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar to mine,
but my span is longer. She bowls okay the second and third game, but it
takes her a while to get into the swing of things. The first game is usually
pretty bad. The only open she had in the second and third games was a 5-7
split in the tenth of the third game.
The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to fit
her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would be
better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
Thanks,
Dar






 
Date: 08 Jan 2008 17:37:21
From: Ken
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
Big Al's Pro Shop
804-301-3152
Not in a Center. I had him drill a Lane 1 H20 3 weeks ago and haven't shot
under 215 with it.
Coached the 1986 YABA National Scratch Champion (my kid)

"Darby" <tenpinhawkeye@mchsi.com > wrote in message
news:2v%fj.287533$Fc.70077@attbi_s21...
> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave
> her an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar to
> mine, but my span is longer. She bowls okay the second and third game, but
> it takes her a while to get into the swing of things. The first game is
> usually pretty bad. The only open she had in the second and third games
> was a 5-7 split in the tenth of the third game.
> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to
> fit her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would be
> better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
> Thanks,
> Dar
>
>




  
Date: 09 Jan 2008 02:55:02
From: Darby
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
I thought Big Al was in Portland, OR??? Or is this a different Big Al?
Thanks, I've forwarded your email to my daughter.
Dar

"Ken" <kwrusse@hotmail.com > wrote

> Big Al's Pro Shop
> 804-301-3152
> Not in a Center. I had him drill a Lane 1 H20 3 weeks ago and haven't shot
> under 215 with it.
> Coached the 1986 YABA National Scratch Champion (my kid)
>
> "Darby" <tenpinhawkeye@mchsi.com> wrote in message
> news:2v%fj.287533$Fc.70077@attbi_s21...
>> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
>> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave
>> her an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar
>> to mine, but my span is longer. She bowls okay the second and third game,
>> but it takes her a while to get into the swing of things. The first game
>> is usually pretty bad. The only open she had in the second and third
>> games was a 5-7 split in the tenth of the third game.
>> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
>> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
>> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to
>> fit her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would
>> be better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
>> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
>> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
>> Thanks,
>> Dar
>>
>>
>
>




   
Date: 08 Jan 2008 23:47:24
From: Tony R Smith
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
Different Al I believe. You might be talking about Al Whiteman, who used
to post here and is, or was, a Pro Shop owner and PBA member in Portland
Oregon.

Darby wrote:
> I thought Big Al was in Portland, OR??? Or is this a different Big Al?
> Thanks, I've forwarded your email to my daughter.
> Dar
>
> "Ken" <kwrusse@hotmail.com> wrote
>
>> Big Al's Pro Shop
>> 804-301-3152
>> Not in a Center. I had him drill a Lane 1 H20 3 weeks ago and haven't shot
>> under 215 with it.
>> Coached the 1986 YABA National Scratch Champion (my kid)
>>
>> "Darby" <tenpinhawkeye@mchsi.com> wrote in message
>> news:2v%fj.287533$Fc.70077@attbi_s21...
>>> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
>>> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave
>>> her an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar
>>> to mine, but my span is longer. She bowls okay the second and third game,
>>> but it takes her a while to get into the swing of things. The first game
>>> is usually pretty bad. The only open she had in the second and third
>>> games was a 5-7 split in the tenth of the third game.
>>> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
>>> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
>>> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to
>>> fit her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would
>>> be better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
>>> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
>>> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
>>> Thanks,
>>> Dar
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>


 
Date: 06 Jan 2008 13:37:02
From:
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
On Jan 6, 2:33=A0am, "Darby" <tenpinhawk...@mchsi.com > wrote:

> =A0 =A0 But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?

Richmond, Virginia (are there other Richmonds, don't know). Assuming
VA, I have some good friends in that area from Team Internet and the
Roto Grip staff and can check for you.

Curious -- why did Denny need to take one of your balls with him
rather than drill from a spec sheet and his notes on how to finish
your thumb? That is odd.

Mark



 
Date: 06 Jan 2008 17:53:29
From: newsreader
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
Darby wrote:
> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave her
> an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar to mine,
> but my span is longer. She bowls okay the second and third game, but it
> takes her a while to get into the swing of things. The first game is usually
> pretty bad. The only open she had in the second and third games was a 5-7
> split in the tenth of the third game.
> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to fit
> her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would be
> better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
> Thanks,
> Dar
>
>
She "drops the ball a lot".. you absolutely sure she doesn't actually
pull her hand out of the ball because if a gearing issue.

really 'dropping' the ball is very rare.


Am not being a semantic devil here but bowling is littered with common
phrases that actually don't make sense. e.g. "dropping your shoulder"
which if course is not physically possible - what people really do is
bend at the waist (sideways) and the effect is to angle the shoulder
line hence called "dropping the shoulder".

It is when it comes to cause and effect and fixing someone's game that
it becomes important to use correct tautology IMV.



  
Date: 06 Jan 2008 20:03:31
From: Darby
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?

"newsreader" <whome@127.0.0.1 > wrote
> Darby wrote:
>> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
>> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave
>> her an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar
>> to mine, but my span is longer.

>> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
>> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
>> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to
>> fit her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would
>> be better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
>> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
>> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
>> Thanks,
>> Dar
> She "drops the ball a lot".. you absolutely sure she doesn't actually pull
> her hand out of the ball because if a gearing issue.
>
> really 'dropping' the ball is very rare.
>
>
> Am not being a semantic devil here but bowling is littered with common
> phrases that actually don't make sense. e.g. "dropping your shoulder"
> which if course is not physically possible - what people really do is bend
> at the waist (sideways) and the effect is to angle the shoulder line hence
> called "dropping the shoulder".
>
> It is when it comes to cause and effect and fixing someone's game that it
> becomes important to use correct tautology IMV.

Thanks for your response.
I'm not sure what you mean by "Gearing issue". Is this a term from
coaching school? I've been to several, but none lately, so there must be a
lot of terminology I'm not familiar with. I've been coaching for 27 years. I
don't have the knowledge to help advanced bowlers. I work mainly with the
Youth program in our town.
As I see it, she loses grasp of the ball as her thumb releases. She
doesn't get her fingers into the release, the momentum is what gets the ball
through the heads. I do not remember her dropping the ball when she bowled
in high school.
It is work for her to stretch her hand into the ball, I don't think
she's fully grasping the ball. I could be wrong. Explain Gearing, please.
You could have an idea that hasn't occurred to me. I'm sure no expert and
can use any help.
My ball driller is Denny Torgerson, "Torgy" from Bowling This Month. He
moved several years ago and took one of my balls with him so he could
continue drilling for me. But 17 years is too much time for him to know what
my daughter needs. I have a call in to him too, but thought someone here
might be familiar with the area.
Dar
>




   
Date: 06 Jan 2008 20:23:06
From: newsreader
Subject: Re: Pro shops in the Richmond area?
Darby wrote:
> "newsreader" <whome@127.0.0.1> wrote
>> Darby wrote:
>>> We visited our daughter over the holidays. She has taken up bowling again
>>> after a 17 year vacation. She had a 12 pound ball in high school, I gave
>>> her an old reactive/particle 14 pound ball of mine. Her hand is similar
>>> to mine, but my span is longer.
>
>>> The Pro shop owner in the center where they joined a league said the
>>> ball fits her fine. I'm not sure he's right. She seems to drop the ball a
>>> lot. I'd like her to find a good pro shop and have the ball redrilled to
>>> fit her hand. Once she has the right feel I'm sure her first ball would
>>> be better. Then she could buy a new one next year.
>>> But first we have to find someone to trust. Do any of you know of
>>> anyone, or have a suggestion as to how to find someone?
>>> Thanks,
>>> Dar
>> She "drops the ball a lot".. you absolutely sure she doesn't actually pull
>> her hand out of the ball because if a gearing issue.
>>
>> really 'dropping' the ball is very rare.
>>
>>
>> Am not being a semantic devil here but bowling is littered with common
>> phrases that actually don't make sense. e.g. "dropping your shoulder"
>> which if course is not physically possible - what people really do is bend
>> at the waist (sideways) and the effect is to angle the shoulder line hence
>> called "dropping the shoulder".
>>
>> It is when it comes to cause and effect and fixing someone's game that it
>> becomes important to use correct tautology IMV.
>
> Thanks for your response.
> I'm not sure what you mean by "Gearing issue". Is this a term from
> coaching school? I've been to several, but none lately, so there must be a
> lot of terminology I'm not familiar with. I've been coaching for 27 years. I
> don't have the knowledge to help advanced bowlers. I work mainly with the
> Youth program in our town.
> As I see it, she loses grasp of the ball as her thumb releases. She
> doesn't get her fingers into the release, the momentum is what gets the ball
> through the heads. I do not remember her dropping the ball when she bowled
> in high school.
> It is work for her to stretch her hand into the ball, I don't think
> she's fully grasping the ball. I could be wrong. Explain Gearing, please.
> You could have an idea that hasn't occurred to me. I'm sure no expert and
> can use any help.
> My ball driller is Denny Torgerson, "Torgy" from Bowling This Month. He
> moved several years ago and took one of my balls with him so he could
> continue drilling for me. But 17 years is too much time for him to know what
> my daughter needs. I have a call in to him too, but thought someone here
> might be familiar with the area.
> Dar
>
>
gearing - synchronisation between armswing and footwork.
You can have a great swing and great footwork but if the gears don't mesh...

sure sounds like it from your description - not getting her hand behind
the ball. assuming her footstep cadence is good and she hasn't got
overly long (or short) steps in there... what is the position of her
bowling arm in relation to her leading leg on her key step i.e. the
second step of the last four ? in front of the vertical (how much),
vertical, behind the vertical (how much)
I ask this as most often I see a muscled placeaway slowing the arm down
and so the arm on the second (of four) step is well in front of the leg
- nowhere near vertical and a long long way from the 'pro angle'.
Something I have used to spot dropped ball difficulties is to stand on
the approach on the bowling arm side of the bowler but a few lanes away
and watch them bowl a clutch of balls, 6 8 or 10 maybe. For the first
several deliveries watch the ball's path through space and not the
bowler (not in the slightest) after you have seen enough to know that
you have the arc of the ball in space firmly fixed in your mind switch
your view to the bowling hand (only) of the bowler. get that fixed in
your mind. When you have them both the compare them.
How long this takes is down to you and not the bowler, it is something
you may see straight away, another guy may take longer. But after doing
this several times you will find that it is something that you can do
quite quickly and easily. All you are doing is comparing those two arcs.

You will be amazed to find that often the hand and the ball actually
describe two different arcs and that the release happens at the point
where the arcs 'cross'. In fact in these circumstances that is exactly
where the release HAS to happen. Have seen this a lot in bowlers with
dropped ball syndrome.
As for fixing it, pretty hard without seeing the bowler. it could be a
simple thing or it could be some work.

It sounds to me like your driller is right and that the ball does fit.
Am sure you have checked yourself. It would have to be way off to cause
real 'dropping' and you would spot that easily. technique issues far far
far more likely it seems to me from your description.